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Jay Brower (jaymothy.eth) pfp
Jay Brower (jaymothy.eth)
@jayb
still kind of amazed that a snapchain node costs >$1k to run per month i wonder how many users' data queries and writes can fit on one node either neynar loses money on their low/free tiers, or every dev on here is pooled into one node 😆
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rish pfp
rish
@rish
is there a way to not lose money on a free tier? would love to make money while giving away an infrastructure product for free
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Quazia pfp
Quazia
@quazia
Just make devs watch a 30 second add before we process their requests 🫠 🫠 🫠
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Jay Brower (jaymothy.eth) pfp
Jay Brower (jaymothy.eth)
@jayb
you guys have any thoughts on billing x402-style per-request? make your free tier just bill automatically through the User's wallet, and ask the farcaster guys to set up a 7702 delegation for all users s.t you can do this gaslessly + charge from the user's USDC balance (even without a prompt). session keys but for micropayments on infra wonder what the economics are for that
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rish pfp
rish
@rish
how is it free if we are charging per API call? x402 is already enabled on all our APIs. Don't pass in the api key and it will automatically prompt you. More here: https://neynar.com/blog/agents-frames-and-the-future-of-farcaster-neynar-s-vision-for-x402
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Jay Brower (jaymothy.eth) pfp
Jay Brower (jaymothy.eth)
@jayb
oh that's awesome! now to see the gasless USDC payments w/ session keys, so these requests can just happen instantly for the user "Neynar (infra) may periodically charge up to 0.03 for access to farcaster data. Tap to approve" and then the rest just happens in the background
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Quazia pfp
Quazia
@quazia
x402 is all already signature driven so pretty easy to just sign on request, not a ton of a need for session keys. If you were to use a session key driven approach you'd probably want to implement that at the facilitator level
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Jay Brower (jaymothy.eth) pfp
Jay Brower (jaymothy.eth)
@jayb
if you show your user a prompt every time you want 0.0003 USDC from them the UX is probably horrendous i'd rather jsay "Neynar may charge up to 3c for using this app. Tap to continue", user sets that up basically one time, and then your MiniApp can make as many NeyNar requests as you want with x402 mitigated automatically (no UI, just auto-pay) so: - delegate your user's farcaster wallet to be a porto.sh / 7702 wallet - warpcast provides gasless sends for transactions touching neynar (def doable) - single time popup "Neynar may spend up to 0.01 USDC while interacting with this app" -> generate a session key. - developer builds miniapps, drives traffic toward neynar apis. - neynar apis trigger an x402 payments flow, on receipt the client just submits the payment automatically via session key. - call resolves, app gets data. if my user needs to see a "this post costs 0.0003 USDC" screen, we've failed them
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Quazia pfp
Quazia
@quazia
This paywall only shows up if you're in a browser - are you familiar with the x402 spec?
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Jay Brower (jaymothy.eth) pfp
Jay Brower (jaymothy.eth)
@jayb
right, and i think my point is that if your user doesn't have a session key ready to go and fulfill the 0.0003c bill, you're showing them a prompt to send again (effectively a random paywall) you need gasless USDC sends w/ session keys for the spec to work at the infra level for users
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Lincoln pfp
Lincoln
@lincoln
yeah we've thought about a few different approaches here, agreed on a session keys/spend permissions implementation as elegant for an end user with a wallet. We're thinking about doing this via a "usage-based" payment scheme where a user agrees to pay a maximum of $X. The primary use case to start is for LLM inference, which has an arbitrary number of output tokens therefore price, but I think it could apply to this too
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